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Partner Contact in Standard?
Posted by Frank
2/8/2001  10:14:00 AM
Among the best trainers around the Northeast here, there seems to be an increasingly deep split over the necessity of contact in technique - either vigorously insisting upon its necessity, or vigorously asserting it is unnessessary. Both sides have world-class dancers standing behind their claims.

Anyone wish to shine some knowledgeable light, either way?

At my lower level I find contact, when comfortable for partner, can be helpful. I find it quite difficult to maintain in QS, and I have yet to find it necessary to technique in any dance. It can feel wonderful to me with one partner, or be a real obstruction to movement with another. It seems better to me to give the lady room to dance wherever she feels & follows best (but what do I know?). Some of us travel to avail ourselves of more than one trainer to benefit from what they may offer when affordable. At $65/hr or more, there is precious little time to fool with dance position philosophy while trying to perfect movement.

Seasoned, wise input?

re: Partner Contact in Standard?
Posted by dancingmelmel
2/9/2001  2:04:00 AM
Frank,

This is quite a can of worms, and I'm going to try to give you a very thorough answer, since I'm not exactly sure what you're asking.

I believe you're talking about the importance of maintaining full body contact while learning/working on dance technique. (Let me know how I'm doing here.) You also mention dancing with different ladies, presumably in social situations? One thing at a time, though...

I would say that for learning, teaching, practicing or gauging technique, body contact is usually helpful, rarely necessary, and sometimes detrimental. It all depends on your stage of learning, and what you're working on.

For a brand new student, for example, body contact will inhibit movement tremendously, and make learning to dance pretty darn hellish. I don't recommend it.

Once a student has learned some of the fundamentals of movement, body contact is not only the next natural part of technique to be learned, it is also an invaluable teaching tool. The additional communication inherant to body contact allows the teacher to feel what the student is doing wrong, and the student to feel what the teacher is doing right. Issues with the student's posture and movement are more thoroughly felt and better addressed.

Of course at the beginning, feeling everything more clearly usually means feeling uncomfortable in some way...separating and bumping into each other, tweaking posture, arching to maintain contact. There is tremendous value at times to using a practice hold, or normal dance position minus the body contact for working on quality and freedom of movement, swing, etc... Learning certain techniques with a freer connection, and then applying them in body contact can improve one's dancing (and therefore one's connection) immensely.

Now a quick discussion of how body contact is maintained. (This is relevant to the social dancing issue.) All points of contact should be fairly light, with enough tone to feel well connected, but not so much as to require any strain or tension, or to disturb your partner's position or balance. When in motion, body contact is maintained by both partners using the same leg and body speed, and moving their weight through each other. Body contact should not be maintained by hanging on to one's partner. This is so important it bears repeating. BODY CONTACT SHOULD NOT BE MAINTAINED BY HANGING ON TO ONE'S PARTNER! Therefore when social dancing, you can only have body contact if both partners take and maintain that position. If you don't have body contact, or close to it, it's probably not a good idea to do things like pivots.

Finally, while body contact is wonderful, and an integral part of really good dancing, it is by no means the most important element. To me, quality of movement is the most important thing...of course, good posture is integral to quality of movement, and once you have those two things you might as well throw in body contact...it's practically a natural result anyway. But I digress. Of course, body contact isn't the only interface or method of communication between partners...how about the hands, or the arm on the back, or even visual communication? I would much rather dance with someone who moved well, but in a more open position, than with someone who had a perfect full body contact dance position, but only moved halfway decently.

Okay, I've gone on too long already! Hope this helps. Correct me on the question if it doesn't.

-Melissa

re: Partner Contact in Standard?
Posted by Dronak
2/14/2001  11:43:00 AM
Little Lily... --

A few comments, but from the bottom up. Tango walks curve because you're taking steps in CBMP and with side leads. I wouldn't necessarily attribute the curving to the closer hold; I see the hold as more of an adapation of the normal hold that allows you to take the walks in that fashion. I could be wrong though and I'm sure someone can correct me if I am. As for getting stepped on going backwards in Natural and Reverse Turns, it shouldn't happen. As one of my teachers said, if you get stepped on going backwards it's your fault. Make sure you're taking a long enough step and reaching back with your foot and leg, not just sort of dropping it behind you. Also make sure that your dance position is correct. If the lady is offset to the man's right properly, your legs and feet should not be in a direct line with each other, so you shouldn't get stepped on. As for the Natural Spin Turn, well, unless you're starting it from an OP position, it's supposed to be done in line, so you shouldn't really be sneaking OP. There's also no CBMP on the first step according to the technique book. As a sort of side comment, if you use a proper body contact (as you note right front to right front) you should be able to keep it in OP and CBMP positions. It may have to adjust since your position is changing, but it shouldn't disappear. But the body contact isn't an absolute necessity, either. It can help, but it's got to be done right. If you're not comfortable with it, you can generally do fine without it, so do what works. After some time and practice maybe you'll be ready to try the figures with body contact.

--
James Marshall
marshall@astro.umd.edu
http://www.astro.umd.edu/~marshall

re: Partner Contact in Standard?
Posted by dancingmelmel
2/12/2001  12:52:00 AM
Frank,

In your most recent post, were you refering to my post as an argument for the "contact side"? I actually intended to point out the benefits of contact in certain situations, as well as the drawbacks of contact in other situations. (Appropriate and inappropriate uses, etc.)

Just how extreme are the oposing viewpoints you're hearing? I'd be very interested to know in more detail, as I'm sure others would as well. Please, enlighten us!

Melissa

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