Dave . Take a note of what NFR means, and how to apply it. I will just add this. On the first step of the Natural in the Waltz for the lady there is NFR. On the same step for the man there is foot rise. The lady follows the man only after he has swung past, never with him. When the man is going back now the roles are reversed. Its all in the book and has been since the beginning. It just takes some teachers 80 odd years to find out. If you find your centre is being taken away by the lady or you to her. Just look right there. How does one know when the centre is gone. Easy. Are you still in the same position as when you started.

"Dave . Take a note of what NFR means, and how to apply it. I will just add this. On the first step of the Natural in the Waltz"

I though you were trying to explain why the backwardes partner does swing in a feather? Guess you abandoned that idiotic argument in favor of another...

"for the lady there is NFR. On the same step for the man there is foot rise. The lady follows the man only after he has swung past, never with him."

Her swing is indeed in some sense delayed compared to his, but it is still a swing.

"I though you were trying to explain why the backwardes partner does swing in a feather? Guess you abandoned that idiotic argument in favor of another..."

sorry about the typo - quickstep had claimed the backward partner DOESNT swing in the feather... sheer idiocy.

Dave introduced the Natural in the Waltz. But it doesn't matter either way no two people swing at the same time. By the by . You will have noticed that Alex Moore doesn't give swing a mention but does mention sway. Interesting. The delay you mentioned is caused by NFR.

"The delay you mentioned is caused by NFR."

Not really. NFR is an effect, not a cause.

The cause is a desire to let the man go past her.

Something which doesn't happen in the feather BTW - there both partners swing at the same time.

(I'm sure you will come up with some idiotic disagreement - which I will prememptively dismiss by pointing you that you can commence the feather outside parnter without altering the timing of its swings)

And yes, the lady has NFR in the feather too - but for a different reason - not because the man is passing her, but because she is rolling all the way through her feet, something she doesn't do on step on of hte waltz. Same term, two VERY DIFFERENT actions.

One is sideways , the other is straight behind for the following step. Other than that the delay is still there. Have a look at a Extended Wave when the lady is preparing to do the Feather Step after her Three Step. Can you see the delay, for want of a better word, by the man on the slow with NFR on his left foot as the lady prepares to swings past. In the Waltz . Do you see the NFR by the lady , this time on step one of a Natural

"One is sideways , the other is straight behind for the following step. Other than that the delay is still there."

There is a sort of delay, or differing of emphasis between the partners in a turning figure, but NONE in a NON-TURNING figure such as the FEATHER STEP.

"Have a look at a Extended Wave when the lady is preparing to do the Feather Step after her Three Step. Can you see the delay, for want of a better word, by the man on the slow with NFR on his left foot as the lady prepares to swings past."

Not if he's halfway decent. If he is, his movement will exactly match what he is suggesting to his partner. And she isn't passing him for the record, nor would he would pass her on a forward feather. It's all in the use of the feet, to project the bodies right through and beyond the point of balance.

Just a small point. A Feather Step is now by some classed as a turning figure. Because it does turn when danced diagonal to the centre, and all turning figures have sway which it has.
I think you will find that with the correct contact the chest of each partner touching the other, that either one or the other whoever is going forward will overtake the other still keeping the same contact.
Put a line across a tennis ball. Turn it on its axis clockwise to a diagonal to the centre. Where is the right side of the line across the centre of the ball now. The left side has past it. Then if this were a Feather Step it would then come back into a neutral position for the next move.

"Just a small point. A Feather Step is now by some classed as a turning figure. Because it does turn when danced diagonal to the centre"

It's a very interesting sort of turn though - nothing in common with the turn of a natural turn at all, and absolutely no passing of the partner.

What happens is that the direction of travel across the floor redirects somewhat towards the LOD, so that step three lands only in CBMP, and not across in CBMP. But you don't actually change alignment towards LOD - if you did, your commencing alignment of the following figure would be all messed up.

"I think you will find that with the correct contact the chest of each partner touching the other"

Often yes.

"that either one or the other whoever is going forward will overtake the other still keeping the same contact."

ABSOLUTELY NOT! If that is happening, your idea of outside partner is all messed up!

"Put a line across a tennis ball. Turn it on its axis clockwise to a diagonal to the centre."

Totally flawed anaology. A tennis ball is a single symmetic object of fixed shape, a dance couple is two objects, which CHANGE SHAPE when they go to an outside partner configuration. You don't really rotate around a common center to get there, you SHAPE around it as your reconfigure your body into a CBMP-compatible position - the essentially characteristic of outside partner actions.